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answer, he told me to work with david meaning david pecker and get control over this. purchase the life rights. we need to stop this from getting out. was there any conversation about pushing it to a period of time? yes. during the negotiation to purchase and acquire the life rights, we are talking about stormy daniels, what he had said to me is what i want you to do is just push it out as long as you can. just to get past the election, because if i when, it has no relevance, i will be president. if i lose, i don't even care. question, did you bring up at the time the topic of his wife, milani a and one of those conversations with mr. trump? >> i did. >> what did you say? i said how is things going to go with upstairs. question, are you concerned about that? answer, i was. what, if anything did he say to you about that? answer, don't worry he goes. he goes how long do you think i will be on the market for, not long. question, what did you understand that to mean? he wasn't thinking about melania. this was all about the campaign. a few things, nicole. women will hate me
answer, he told me to work with david meaning david pecker and get control over this. purchase the life rights. we need to stop this from getting out. was there any conversation about pushing it to a period of time? yes. during the negotiation to purchase and acquire the life rights, we are talking about stormy daniels, what he had said to me is what i want you to do is just push it out as long as you can. just to get past the election, because if i when, it has no relevance, i will be...
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May 18, 2024
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he says he made that recording in order to reassure david pecker the reimbursement to him was coming. it is not directly on the stormy daniels payment but i think it kind of shows in a circumstantial way that trump was being kept apprised of all of the developments. >> why would he know about that and not stormy daniels ? >> you know about david pecker being reimbursed and you don't know michael cohen is going to pay back this money and legal expense is ? it doesn't track. >> joyce, feel free to state the obvious here but what are the challenges for trump if he insists on testifying? >> right, there are so many of them, alex. for one thing, the first one will be for him to stick to the truth. that has always been a big challenge for him under oath. he could object himself to perjury or push the jury over the edge to convicting him. but, also, there is this entire demeanor issue. this is a judge who has shown ability to have great control of his courtroom. if trump makes the bombastic statement he's prone to understand, this is a judge who will shut him down. nothing good happens for t
he says he made that recording in order to reassure david pecker the reimbursement to him was coming. it is not directly on the stormy daniels payment but i think it kind of shows in a circumstantial way that trump was being kept apprised of all of the developments. >> why would he know about that and not stormy daniels ? >> you know about david pecker being reimbursed and you don't know michael cohen is going to pay back this money and legal expense is ? it doesn't track. >>...
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May 18, 2024
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that is why you had david pecker, the national enquirer person at the beginning, laying out the whole conspiracy , laying out that he is detail oriented and micromanaging. so, what you hear brought in by the prosecution, really that donald trump did not know about an advisor that reported directly to him, and michael cohen reported that directly to him, he did not know what they were doing and you have those 11 checks to donald trump signed. so, that is going to be the prosecution's argument. >> suzanne, one of the things that i thought was pretty interesting in this cross of michael cohen was all focus on revenge. the fact that you had the idea that cohen was singularly focused on this. this is the thing that moved him more than anything else. what was your take regarding the effectiveness of this revenge angle to sort of create that moment of death for one juror to say, really at the end of the day this brother was just mad. >> i think we have to step back and talk a little bit about michael: before i get to that. because michael: is critical for people who are kind of following thi
that is why you had david pecker, the national enquirer person at the beginning, laying out the whole conspiracy , laying out that he is detail oriented and micromanaging. so, what you hear brought in by the prosecution, really that donald trump did not know about an advisor that reported directly to him, and michael cohen reported that directly to him, he did not know what they were doing and you have those 11 checks to donald trump signed. so, that is going to be the prosecution's argument....
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. >> she said david pecker in ami hadn't held up their end of the bargain weeks after this interview, she settled that suit and was released from her contract some people hearing that are going to say, look you want this is your in inner for the money they're going to say, okay, obviously, we are not paying you for this interview. we don't pay for interviews, but you may go from here and write a book or make a movie, or whatever it may be, two that you say what bottom line is this? i've offered to give back the one 50 even though i only got 55% of that, i've offered to give back the one 50 just to have my my story writes back the stories out there. now i'm not telling the nitty-gritty details as you can see, i'm very selective in what i'm what i'm saying about our relationship i'm not out to make money on this. i'm out to get my rights back to prove a contract was illegal that i was taken advantage of and then go back from my life period did it anger you? i mean, it's part of this because people, the white house have said, you're lying, you're not telling the truth i don't know when l
. >> she said david pecker in ami hadn't held up their end of the bargain weeks after this interview, she settled that suit and was released from her contract some people hearing that are going to say, look you want this is your in inner for the money they're going to say, okay, obviously, we are not paying you for this interview. we don't pay for interviews, but you may go from here and write a book or make a movie, or whatever it may be, two that you say what bottom line is this? i've...
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and you know, i keep the knee back to the other testimony that we heard for david pecker from hope hicks, everyone who tie this back to the election, saying this is very clearly a david pecker said they didn't want the story from karen mcdougal to embarrass trump or hurt his election chances. hope hicks said that trump's opinion in the white house was better to deal with the stormy daniels story after he was president, then then before i mean, do you think the prosecution has done enough to prove the campaign finance violation by hate to sound too much like a lawyer. but the answer is it depends potentially, yes, in part because the campaign finance statute, unlike very specific and somewhat byzantine federal campaign statutes, the type that i used to prosecute is very vague here, and i've got a note just so i get it correctly. new york election law 17-152 prohibits conspiracies to promote the election of a specific canada and today through unlawful means. i don't know sitting here today exactly what that means. it's broad, however, and that's very good because it gives the government th
and you know, i keep the knee back to the other testimony that we heard for david pecker from hope hicks, everyone who tie this back to the election, saying this is very clearly a david pecker said they didn't want the story from karen mcdougal to embarrass trump or hurt his election chances. hope hicks said that trump's opinion in the white house was better to deal with the stormy daniels story after he was president, then then before i mean, do you think the prosecution has done enough to...
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there's a reason why david pecker, the former publisher of the national enquirer, went first, to show there's a culture here. there was a system here. stormy daniels talked about the system. hope hicks took the stand and talked about her work in that time. all of these people clubbed michael cohen when like he was a piÑata in the week before he took the stand and i think that was for the sole purpose of getting it into the jury's head that michael cohen is not a good guy. and you are going to see a not good guy take the stand. so just take all of that information in and then pay attention to the law and to what is at stake. i think -- the defense -- i would love for them to make their case. they are hammering michael cohen but i have not heard them rebut any of the allegations against the former president and that is something i would love to see. eliana: the case will be this is not a crime. you talked about the other witnesses. stormy daniels was up there talking about things that are not appropriate to repeat on this network. michael cohen is the key witness to the crime, which is
there's a reason why david pecker, the former publisher of the national enquirer, went first, to show there's a culture here. there was a system here. stormy daniels talked about the system. hope hicks took the stand and talked about her work in that time. all of these people clubbed michael cohen when like he was a piÑata in the week before he took the stand and i think that was for the sole purpose of getting it into the jury's head that michael cohen is not a good guy. and you are going to...
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even when i met with david pecker and dylan and keith in new york, after this is back last august, they oftenly, many more opportunities, but i haven't seen anything yet. not that that's not part of the contract, but my point is, they keep dangling the karatay i'm not playing that game anymore are you aware of or have you spoken to any women with similar stories who have come forward? no, i haven't spoken to anyone. i know other i've heard other stories from other people, but it's hearsay. it's not like the girl directly to me, but no, i can't comment on that would you have come forward publicly if stormy daniels hadn't come forward do you think that made an impact on you i definitely think it made a little bit of an impact on me. it gives you more. it takes a little bit of the fairway however, i probably would have just because as i'm learning about this contract and the people involved in the way i was treated and all the behind the scenes, things that i wasn't aware about and all the work i'm not getting which a contracted for yeah, i probably would have come forward if you didn't ge
even when i met with david pecker and dylan and keith in new york, after this is back last august, they oftenly, many more opportunities, but i haven't seen anything yet. not that that's not part of the contract, but my point is, they keep dangling the karatay i'm not playing that game anymore are you aware of or have you spoken to any women with similar stories who have come forward? no, i haven't spoken to anyone. i know other i've heard other stories from other people, but it's hearsay. it's...
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david pecker in his testimony testified that michael cohen shared with him not only that he had been stiffed on his bonus but his outrage that trump by late december of 2016 hadn't repaid him. he asked pecker, could you talk to the boss about this? pecker said he then had a conversation with former president trump in which trump never answered him directly but mentioned michael cohen's significant wealth outside of the trump organization, including through his taxi medallion. so they said cohen paying on his own would be out of character and beyond any authority that he had and that he complained to pecker specifically about that, that's huge in terms of corroborating cohen's testimony. >> there's also the recording of michael cohen and trump discussing the karen acdougall payment. >> i spoke to allen about it when it comes time for the financing -- >> what financing -- >> we'll have to pay. >> no, no, no. >> todd blanche tried to make a big deal about cohen secretly recording a client. that ended up falling flat that said there's a crime fraud exemption to any kind of confidentialit
david pecker in his testimony testified that michael cohen shared with him not only that he had been stiffed on his bonus but his outrage that trump by late december of 2016 hadn't repaid him. he asked pecker, could you talk to the boss about this? pecker said he then had a conversation with former president trump in which trump never answered him directly but mentioned michael cohen's significant wealth outside of the trump organization, including through his taxi medallion. so they said cohen...
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david pecker had a hideous story in terms of this country. hope hicks, as lawrence o'donnell said, is no paragon. and, you know, was saying a lot of things. and very complicit in a lot of horrific things. so, no one's going to be saying, you have to believe michael cohen, except the defense will be saying exactly -- they will try to say, he's critical -- >> and that that call was essential. i think the other piece of it and the other question -- and i don't know this. i've only been a juror. i've never studied them. i don't know the science of them. i've never selected them. i think it probably says more about me than anybody else that i didn't think twice to sit on one. we don't know what they latched on to. but it is undeniable that the two witnesses that were slaughtered most brutally by trump's team were stormy daniels, the woman he chose to have sex with, and michael cohen, the man he asked to cover it up. those things are -- they may sort of speak to your gut than what's happening in the courtroom, but it's undeniable. >> and i was sitt
david pecker had a hideous story in terms of this country. hope hicks, as lawrence o'donnell said, is no paragon. and, you know, was saying a lot of things. and very complicit in a lot of horrific things. so, no one's going to be saying, you have to believe michael cohen, except the defense will be saying exactly -- they will try to say, he's critical -- >> and that that call was essential. i think the other piece of it and the other question -- and i don't know this. i've only been a...
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his testimony has been corroborated by other witnesses including david pecker and hope hicks. there's a mountain of document tear evidence that corroborates time lines and evidence that supports the fraud that has been alleged. i think costello is a political trick, the hail mary pass being thrown at the end of a damming are prosecution. >> interesting way to put that. given that we look ahead to michael cohen returning to the stand on monday, tim, what has been your sense of how he has comported himself during this trial, during his testimony. >> michael's a really volatile, unreliable person generally, and i think he's been almost a stellar witness throughout. he has been calm. he has been fact driven. he's depth largely his own emotions in check. i think todd blanche has given a d minus to a c performance as a defense attorney here. i think he was trying to get michael cohen rattled, but her didn't present a compelling compelling narrative to the jury, about why michael cohen shouldn't be trusted in the context of this specific case. he larded an attack with a lot of very c
his testimony has been corroborated by other witnesses including david pecker and hope hicks. there's a mountain of document tear evidence that corroborates time lines and evidence that supports the fraud that has been alleged. i think costello is a political trick, the hail mary pass being thrown at the end of a damming are prosecution. >> interesting way to put that. given that we look ahead to michael cohen returning to the stand on monday, tim, what has been your sense of how he has...
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cohen that are already corroborated by david pecker and that's what they should be focusing on. and remember you know, you're all talking about how the public is getting in the weeds, you know, or shouldn't. it and can't focus on where this leads us. in november, we've got to be careful at a trial two, there's a lot of weeds you can get stuck in and what you want to be sure you're doing is present. this is showing the jury that when you put all the pieces of the puzzle together if you're the prosecutor that they spell conviction, whether the jury will believe that or recent or whether that will be the result remains to be seen all right. >> judge. case all for us. i thank you very much for joining us this morning. i really appreciate your time all right. >> coming out with how did the coming up u2 coming up next supreme court justice samuel alito, under considerable scrutiny for reportedly flying a flag representing the stop the steal movement outside of his home after the 2020 election, after the insurrection. in fact, plus deadly storms in texas, several other states now, brac
cohen that are already corroborated by david pecker and that's what they should be focusing on. and remember you know, you're all talking about how the public is getting in the weeds, you know, or shouldn't. it and can't focus on where this leads us. in november, we've got to be careful at a trial two, there's a lot of weeds you can get stuck in and what you want to be sure you're doing is present. this is showing the jury that when you put all the pieces of the puzzle together if you're the...
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we have david pecker. we have hope hicks, we have others on the issue of whether they were legal fees or reimbursements, which is what the key second element of the crime is whether they were falsely large as legal fees. we do know from allen weisselberg's handwriting that he took a number, doubled it, and divided it by 12 as james carville would say, it's the mat stupid. there's nothing about legal fees and that math. so those two elements of the crime have been proven michael cohen can be attack. all you all rightfully might say that he wasn't perfect. but there's no doubt that weisselberg wrote in his own handwriting, $420,000 divided by 12, and that 420 from three buckets of money doubled up because of income taxes. that's the case and whatever you say about michael cohen, he has stood up to corroborate corroborate is a corroborating witness. that's my view. >> lanny davis. i appreciate your time. and norm eisen as well, thinking on scraping in court with you coming up. oh, examine how the former presi
we have david pecker. we have hope hicks, we have others on the issue of whether they were legal fees or reimbursements, which is what the key second element of the crime is whether they were falsely large as legal fees. we do know from allen weisselberg's handwriting that he took a number, doubled it, and divided it by 12 as james carville would say, it's the mat stupid. there's nothing about legal fees and that math. so those two elements of the crime have been proven michael cohen can be...
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so when you add to that, the jury is going to be reminded by the prosecution, which is what david pecker said about that original meeting in trump tower, and about the fact that it was not in the interest of his business interests to be paying off women and concerns about things that corroborate a lot of critical points that michael cohen has made. when you think about the fact hope hicks reiterated there was real concern on the side of the campaign, that donald trump was concerned, when you consider the fact there has been reinforcement about it, i mean, if they believed michael cohen, but again, a lot of the points they landed didn't go to some of that testimony, or his demeanor. so what can be easy to forget when you have one witness on the stand, and a lot of hits landed is that when are they really going to remember about what they have heard over the past weeks and how the prosecution is going to land, reminding them of the facts of the case and how is the judge going to tell the jury what these instructions are about their burden, because all of this will be part of what this jury
so when you add to that, the jury is going to be reminded by the prosecution, which is what david pecker said about that original meeting in trump tower, and about the fact that it was not in the interest of his business interests to be paying off women and concerns about things that corroborate a lot of critical points that michael cohen has made. when you think about the fact hope hicks reiterated there was real concern on the side of the campaign, that donald trump was concerned, when you...
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i suspect obviously, i don't that's why this case from day one starting with david pecker and the august 2015 meeting in trump tower where you have pecker agreeing that there is going to be this activity, this catch and kill activity to benefit the campaign and going all throughout the testimony with those corroborating notes in alice and weisselberg's hand this is one tile in a mosaic and even today, cohen was much stronger in the afternoon and the jury does not necessarily fixate on that one moment where there's also three because all during the i mean, for until the exciting in break before the lunch break, i kept sitting there wondering, well, all todd blanche is talking about is just lies by michael cohen about things in general, not anything to do with a document that was signed about stormy daniels or anything to do with stormy downs or anything to do with hush money payments. and to me it felt very meandering and you i was like, okay, yeah, we know the guy has lied a lot and that's exactly except for one thing. >> and that's another blockbuster area of this testimony, which i thi
i suspect obviously, i don't that's why this case from day one starting with david pecker and the august 2015 meeting in trump tower where you have pecker agreeing that there is going to be this activity, this catch and kill activity to benefit the campaign and going all throughout the testimony with those corroborating notes in alice and weisselberg's hand this is one tile in a mosaic and even today, cohen was much stronger in the afternoon and the jury does not necessarily fixate on that one...
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a lot of it is corroborated by david pecker. there's the 2015 meeting with michael cohen. it is explicitly about trying to influence the outcome of the campaign there are other pieces that are also explicit including so can this get to the level it needs to without say this phone call that's right because we do have david pecker's saying that in november, december, michael cohen system, please tell trump to reimburse me that is not michael cohen hiding things from trump. that is trumping in the loop informed about the scheme. so there's other things there, but i think what happened today's still is so devastating. they have to do something right now. if the case ended today and they were final statements, i think they will not be a conviction. >> right. but what we'll see what happens. okay. now, what about trump in the room? >> yeah, top is paying close attention to this more than anyone. i've seen him as far as a witness on the stand and he paid attention, i think to stormy daniels, but he was sort of looking ahead and wanting to ignore her. he was passing notes, i think
a lot of it is corroborated by david pecker. there's the 2015 meeting with michael cohen. it is explicitly about trying to influence the outcome of the campaign there are other pieces that are also explicit including so can this get to the level it needs to without say this phone call that's right because we do have david pecker's saying that in november, december, michael cohen system, please tell trump to reimburse me that is not michael cohen hiding things from trump. that is trumping in the...
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pecker and others as well as the documentation but this is the pitfall of michael cohen, you know. this was a good day for the defense in a bad day for the prosecution and i think that is the first time you can say that in 18 days of this trial. the jury is going to have a lot to assess. the prosecutor will have a chance to redirect with michael cohen, but you know, todd blanche slipped one past the goalie, to continue the hockey metaphor, and the question is, are the prosecutors going to be able to score a few more? >> i want to go back to the last point you were making, christy. monday, redirect time, is this where the prosecution cleans up that sloppiness from today? what do you expect from them? >> i do think they really need to go back to that day, in particular, that october 24th day for that phone call happens, look at all the messages and look at any other messages that day and see if there is any greater context put forth to put some other evidence there for michael cohen and see if he can explain it. what he said on the record was you know, this is my belief about what ha
pecker and others as well as the documentation but this is the pitfall of michael cohen, you know. this was a good day for the defense in a bad day for the prosecution and i think that is the first time you can say that in 18 days of this trial. the jury is going to have a lot to assess. the prosecutor will have a chance to redirect with michael cohen, but you know, todd blanche slipped one past the goalie, to continue the hockey metaphor, and the question is, are the prosecutors going to be...
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. >> you know, they went through the david pecker testimonyough about catch and kill and about nondisclosure. agreem none of that, as you pointed out, is illegal. you there was no crime that they have been able to point to. thenthe you get the salaciouswe material and testimony of stormy danielt s. well, okay, maybe interesting for some people, not me in particular, but salacious. yeah, not relevant. ct not material. nothing. nothing about the law. and and then you had this disaster today. ts disastwhat impact it today v happened to michael cohen today? ughti will say todd blanche wasd masterful today. >> i think that's absolutely correct. you know, look, i was criticizing cohen. he still representing. so he and i go way back. a. we're not particularly fond of each othe fonr. but, you know, this is when people kept on saying, look, he's been coached, he's been preppeepd. i never quite believed that. i certainly believe that he could retain his composure because that's what everyone's telling him to do. but he'sd re a pathological liar. i mean, that's that's his m.o. and you can't put someone
. >> you know, they went through the david pecker testimonyough about catch and kill and about nondisclosure. agreem none of that, as you pointed out, is illegal. you there was no crime that they have been able to point to. thenthe you get the salaciouswe material and testimony of stormy danielt s. well, okay, maybe interesting for some people, not me in particular, but salacious. yeah, not relevant. ct not material. nothing. nothing about the law. and and then you had this disaster...
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david pecker. you had hope hicks everybody knew that the money being paid to stormy daniels was for the campaign. it wasn't to protect him from being embarrassed in front of his wife. that's what the testimony has been so far. and the second most important part of the climb did donald trump ally when he said there were legal fees? well, there is a hot document, meaning a document that's very powerful. and the handwriting verified to be allen weisselberg in which he asked three categories of money that michael spent on behalf of donald trump. one was $130,000 written down in his handwriting times two. and the three categories to edit up to $420,000 divided by let me just sorry. >> michael cohen is clearly important to the prosecution. i mean, he's a critical witness for the prosecution in order. i mean, he's really the only one who can speak to whether donald trump was aware of how this stuff was going to be build the full nature of this scheme. he's the one who gives that testimony, which is why th
david pecker. you had hope hicks everybody knew that the money being paid to stormy daniels was for the campaign. it wasn't to protect him from being embarrassed in front of his wife. that's what the testimony has been so far. and the second most important part of the climb did donald trump ally when he said there were legal fees? well, there is a hot document, meaning a document that's very powerful. and the handwriting verified to be allen weisselberg in which he asked three categories of...
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hope hicks, david pecker, et cetera. i preface this by saying no one can predict what the jury is going to do and we can't get inside the jurors minds, but sitting there today i think todd blanche is not a great defense attorney. he came into the trump world through boris epshteyn who came in through eric trump and you had this series i think of players who get donald trump sears and he gives them a lot of responsibility that maybe they would not otherwise earn and i think there were other people sitting at the defense table who were much more capable than todd blanche. i think he had a horrible first day of cross. i think he recovered today, but what he went through today is an assault on michael cohen's credibility and i think he established that michael cohen is a serial liar, like donald trump's. >> okay, that's the thing. michael cohen, yes, was a liar for 10 years, at the direction, at the behest of donald trump. if they wrote a job description, be my hush money, my liar, my fixer. >> write the media for me. please
hope hicks, david pecker, et cetera. i preface this by saying no one can predict what the jury is going to do and we can't get inside the jurors minds, but sitting there today i think todd blanche is not a great defense attorney. he came into the trump world through boris epshteyn who came in through eric trump and you had this series i think of players who get donald trump sears and he gives them a lot of responsibility that maybe they would not otherwise earn and i think there were other...
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but the michael cohen's act was established by all those other witnesses, david pecker, whom you refer to. but now we come to the crux of the new york state penal code, which is did donald trump had the intent to falsify the business records with only michael cohen's testimony saying what donald trump's new or directed or ordered that's the only thing that people have. the people, meaning the people of the state of new york, the prosecution it is true, it isn't true. >> they've got those records because you've got the notes of weisselberg or he's writing down the $420,000 heisenberg, are the notes of weisselberg michael cohen is the link between allen weisselberg and donald trump. >> and it is his word that is the bridge between those two. >> that's not right mcconney also identified those records and he identified them as being in weisselberg's handwriting. >> he doesn't talk about why it is not on trial designs coming out. let's be a close case. >> hi, to be called psaki. interrupt you, abby, but there was after tuesday's testimony, i believe there was a conference with judge merchan
but the michael cohen's act was established by all those other witnesses, david pecker, whom you refer to. but now we come to the crux of the new york state penal code, which is did donald trump had the intent to falsify the business records with only michael cohen's testimony saying what donald trump's new or directed or ordered that's the only thing that people have. the people, meaning the people of the state of new york, the prosecution it is true, it isn't true. >> they've got those...
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publisher.as the tabloid the national enquirer's david pecker who told the jury there was a plan to suppress stories about the former president. an agreement among friends the former trump aide hope hicks testified about the panic within trump's inner circle after the access hollywood tape became public weeks before the election. the stormy daniels story she said would have compounded the damage. keith davidson, the lawyer who brokered a hush money deal to the adult film star stormy daniels said the payment was designed to keep her quiet about the alleged sexual encounter with the former president in 2006. then there was stormy daniels herself. it is her obligations about the encounter that are at the heart of the trial. she testified for more than seven hours across two days providing salacious details about the affair. it is not the affair. it is the payment to hide the affair and whether it was made to conceal the story from the voting public and covered up as a legal expense in the business records. a misdemeanor that becomes a felony if there is evidence of a campaign-finance violation
publisher.as the tabloid the national enquirer's david pecker who told the jury there was a plan to suppress stories about the former president. an agreement among friends the former trump aide hope hicks testified about the panic within trump's inner circle after the access hollywood tape became public weeks before the election. the stormy daniels story she said would have compounded the damage. keith davidson, the lawyer who brokered a hush money deal to the adult film star stormy daniels...
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pecker. >> if his goal was to undermine cohen, do you think he succeeded? >> somewhat. i think there are aspects of what he did that are completely expected and the d.a. knew. to the point that she has been making the finally todd blanche went through the prior bad acts. susanne said that and i agree it was effective, but it is like where were you on day one? yes i mean he has lied repeatedly. he has committed all sorts of crimes. crimes for donald trump and also not for donald trump. so you really do have to bring that out. the piece on the october 24 call was definitely sort of a gotcha moment that i think was, to me it was sort of theater, because there are so many other calls. okay, you may be able to say two things happened on the call. i did not view this as either or, but you know what, we know keith schiller. by documents. he would be the intermediary like, i've got the phone and here is the president. it is not like the president always picked up his own phone. i sort of went okay, maybe on the 24th, but there are so many other calls. remember the
pecker. >> if his goal was to undermine cohen, do you think he succeeded? >> somewhat. i think there are aspects of what he did that are completely expected and the d.a. knew. to the point that she has been making the finally todd blanche went through the prior bad acts. susanne said that and i agree it was effective, but it is like where were you on day one? yes i mean he has lied repeatedly. he has committed all sorts of crimes. crimes for donald trump and also not for donald...
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obviously, they had a different mo with karen mcdougal and david pecker and the national enquirer. and they chose a different route this way with stormy but it's not really what i think that michael cohen can recall or how a consistently is and telling a story in 24 for events that occurred in 16, 17, and 18, the real issue is what is corroborative, what documents exist, who had the motive what actions were taken i don't think witness needs to know every detail. they just have some part part and the overall factual development of this matter. >> and to that point, about what's corroborative. now that we're getting towards the end of this trial, do you think that there's reasonable doubt that trump committed these crimes and stormy daniels ready for a potential not guilty verdict? >> well, stormy is ready for whatever happens here. i mean, she is very resilient. she's a strong woman and she she's quite impressive in my view on how she used with these issues but you're asking if there's reasonable doubt the question as was he behind the nda, did he orchestrate that? did he cause cohe
obviously, they had a different mo with karen mcdougal and david pecker and the national enquirer. and they chose a different route this way with stormy but it's not really what i think that michael cohen can recall or how a consistently is and telling a story in 24 for events that occurred in 16, 17, and 18, the real issue is what is corroborative, what documents exist, who had the motive what actions were taken i don't think witness needs to know every detail. they just have some part part...
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we did have testimony from david pecker two weeks ago saying that donald trump called him and referred to as our agreement with stormy daniels. but as far as my notes are -- and please anybody on the team here correct me -- i believe this is the first time, though, he has acknowledged this was an nda that he was a part of. >> yeah, andrew, i've never heard him acknowledge that before. >> i haven't either, and i haven't heard what he he said, you know, today. i wonder if he might have been referring to the gag order as opposed to the underlying nda. >> there is this writing in it national review defending the legality of ndas. but he's never acknowledged being under one. >> absolutely. the ndas can be totally legal. there are components that actually at this trial there are components that probably aren't okay, which is michael cohen's provision that he added about the million dollar penalty. keith davidson said that probably wouldn't hold up. but that is -- there are lots and lots of things that donald trump has said that are completely inconsistent with a defense. we pointed out his s
we did have testimony from david pecker two weeks ago saying that donald trump called him and referred to as our agreement with stormy daniels. but as far as my notes are -- and please anybody on the team here correct me -- i believe this is the first time, though, he has acknowledged this was an nda that he was a part of. >> yeah, andrew, i've never heard him acknowledge that before. >> i haven't either, and i haven't heard what he he said, you know, today. i wonder if he might...
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this goes back to early days of this trial, alongside "national enquirer's" david pecker. >> joining us now, nbc news national correspondent yasmin vossoughian outside the court, back with us. chuck rosenberg, catherine christian, and danny cevallos. yasmin, what is happening right now? >> reporter: they're talking about the calls beginning in june of 2016. this is when cohen alleges he informed the former president of the united states, his boss at the time there was a meeting between mcdougal. this was the beginning of the payoff by ami. it was october in which the payoff was made to stormy daniels, initial contact between gina rodriguez and ami was october 8th, 2016. that was about six months after this initial conversation in june when cohen informed donald trump as he alleges about the conversations between dylan howard and karen mcdougal, and their settlement of $150,000. let me read you through quickly this moment if i can. you have a recollection of a call on june 16th of 2016, with president trump, cohen says yes, sir. you called schiller and gave the phone to president trum
this goes back to early days of this trial, alongside "national enquirer's" david pecker. >> joining us now, nbc news national correspondent yasmin vossoughian outside the court, back with us. chuck rosenberg, catherine christian, and danny cevallos. yasmin, what is happening right now? >> reporter: they're talking about the calls beginning in june of 2016. this is when cohen alleges he informed the former president of the united states, his boss at the time there was a...
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first up was the tabloid publisher the national enquirer�*s david pecker, who told the jury there was a secret plan with donald trump to suppress negative stories about the former president — an "agreement among friends", he said. the former trump aide hope hicks testified about the panic within trump's inner circle after the access hollywood tape became publicjust weeks before the election. the stormy daniels story, she said, would have compounded the damage. keith davidson, the lawyer who brokered a hush—money deal to the adult film star stormy daniels, said the payment was designed to keep her quiet about the alleged sexual excounter with the former president in 2006. and then there was stormy daniels herself. it's her allegations about that encounter that are at the heart of the trial. she testified for more than seven hours across two days, providing salacious details about the affair. but it is not the affair — it's the payment to hide the affair and whether it was made to conceal the story from the voting public and later covered up as a legal expense in the business reco
first up was the tabloid publisher the national enquirer�*s david pecker, who told the jury there was a secret plan with donald trump to suppress negative stories about the former president — an "agreement among friends", he said. the former trump aide hope hicks testified about the panic within trump's inner circle after the access hollywood tape became publicjust weeks before the election. the stormy daniels story, she said, would have compounded the damage. keith davidson, the...
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david pecker talking about the meeting, the stormy daniels side of things. there's all of this evidence built that separates the case from michael cohen, and buttresses it and all the problems he has. is it a good idea for the prosecution to end with somebody who can be as problematic as cohen? >> i don't know why they made that choice. i wouldn't have started with him or ended with him. say there's no defense case. the last view of the whole case is michael cohen. maybe it will end on a crescendo, which is good for the prosecution or maybe it won't. but i don't know why they made that choice. i would have ended with a custodian of documents to get their mind off of michael cohen. >> they could still call one more witness after michael cohen. >> they have said that he will be the last witness. until they say the people rest, they can say judge merchan, we actually have one more witness. >> all right. let's keep going. >> katy, you have been named. some of the reporters you have a strong relationship with, chris, katy tur, maggie haberman with the "new york t
david pecker talking about the meeting, the stormy daniels side of things. there's all of this evidence built that separates the case from michael cohen, and buttresses it and all the problems he has. is it a good idea for the prosecution to end with somebody who can be as problematic as cohen? >> i don't know why they made that choice. i wouldn't have started with him or ended with him. say there's no defense case. the last view of the whole case is michael cohen. maybe it will end on a...
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pecker peary why would you do that some think it's his own purposes and then the phone call with the chief of security, cut them at keith scholer which they said was about stormy daniels but blanche is now saying or eliciting from cohen it was about a 14-year-old print color. does this go to the potential instruction from the judge that if the jury believes cohen has lied about anything on the stand they can discount the entirety of his testimony? >> there is a perfect jury instruction i choose in every single trial falseness in human falseness employer about meaning false and one false and everything. if the jury, endless is if the judge allows this instruction which generally speaking it is allowed, if the jury believes michael cohen has lied under oath in this trial inc. can discount the entire testimony. it's very broad and sweeping with the judge decides about that jury instruction in particular but you see that jury instruction just about all trial. >> john: lot more to come this afternoon thank you, mercedes we will be right back in just a few clicks. we came to his house... t
pecker peary why would you do that some think it's his own purposes and then the phone call with the chief of security, cut them at keith scholer which they said was about stormy daniels but blanche is now saying or eliciting from cohen it was about a 14-year-old print color. does this go to the potential instruction from the judge that if the jury believes cohen has lied about anything on the stand they can discount the entirety of his testimony? >> there is a perfect jury instruction i...
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are you talking about the david pecker young call? he says he was doing it to make sure that david pecker, the head of ami i'm remained loyal. now, if the jury is going to buy that, we will see that is the story from michael cohen. >> well, let's see what these texts between mag and cone. we're about trump has leaned forward and there are some texts here. he says blanche says, by the way, did you to tell people you were recording them? and cohen said, no, sir. and let's just be very clear that is highly uncool highly. >> now, some states some states, if it's a one party or a party consent state. >> so what to put some meat and questionable even if it's not illegal new york is one of about 30 states that it's a one-party consent state. so as long as one party consents to recording a phone conversation, you can do it doesn't mean you ought two doesn't mean people won't judge it if you do, people probably won't appreciate they will not appreciate that just as a general understanding, we should know that and particularly if you're not, fo
are you talking about the david pecker young call? he says he was doing it to make sure that david pecker, the head of ami i'm remained loyal. now, if the jury is going to buy that, we will see that is the story from michael cohen. >> well, let's see what these texts between mag and cone. we're about trump has leaned forward and there are some texts here. he says blanche says, by the way, did you to tell people you were recording them? and cohen said, no, sir. and let's just be very clear...
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to your point, the fact is we have had david pecker talk about these discussions, we have had other communications with the trump organizational employees, where these records have been developed. it's going to be very hard when you've got seven to 12 people who have testified about various aspects of these in which donald trump was involved to say that they didn't happen. so in order for this to be effective, he's got to be able to show that this was the only keel piece of conversation, and it did not occur or you cannot trust michael cohen's recollection of this if that's all you have. >> i may be right or wrong. i keep ending up, how are they going to end before lunch or at the end of the day. they're going to lunch, and according to gary grumbach, blanch was getting fired up, right when merchan called for a lunch recess. really took the wind out of the sails. did it or did it leave the jury with that impression? >> my take is i guess, and take this with a grain of salt, maybe thinking like defense attorney. if you're a defense counsel and you're really chugging along and feeling like you're in
to your point, the fact is we have had david pecker talk about these discussions, we have had other communications with the trump organizational employees, where these records have been developed. it's going to be very hard when you've got seven to 12 people who have testified about various aspects of these in which donald trump was involved to say that they didn't happen. so in order for this to be effective, he's got to be able to show that this was the only keel piece of conversation, and it...
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we heard about david pecker, the former "national enquirer" publisher talk about some of his personal conversations with trump. those are things that we knew of, but we never had heard them described publicly before. so, that was pretty interesting. and also a lot of sort of text messages, hope hicks, her internal text messages, trump's former press secretary asking jared kirschner to kill a story about karen mcdougal. we didn't know about that. it is pretty interesting. >> i'm wondering if there are key players jurors haven't heard from that you're aware of that you think would be beneficial to providing more clarity on this story. >> the biggest missing piece here is allen weisselberg who is in prison, trump's former cfo and he was -- is the architect of this reimbursement plan that trump is charged with creating these phony records to hide the reimbursement to michael cohen for stormy daniels. so, you know, he has been loyal to trump and so, you know, he is not going to be testifying as we understand it. the other -- but he would be the only other firsthand person who could confirm
we heard about david pecker, the former "national enquirer" publisher talk about some of his personal conversations with trump. those are things that we knew of, but we never had heard them described publicly before. so, that was pretty interesting. and also a lot of sort of text messages, hope hicks, her internal text messages, trump's former press secretary asking jared kirschner to kill a story about karen mcdougal. we didn't know about that. it is pretty interesting. >> i'm...
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with this meeting in trump tower where he and michael cohen and david pecker decided that they would hatch this catch and kill scheme. trump was in the room, we've got the motivation. the through line from that point up until the middle phase, we got a real sense here of how the scheme played out. that's where the documents came into play, and we got a real sense about the motivation in even more real ways. and now we're at the final phase. i say all of that because this conversation is not happening in a silo, and it is easy for real people on this jury to understand. i'm talking about people, there are only two of them who are lawyers. no disrespect to lawyers on this panel, but you don't need a law degree to follow the ins and outs of this case. it's easy to understand. >> but has the defense offered an alternative narrative at all? >> you know, i haven't seen it in any real way. i'm not sure what some of the lawyers have to say, but i don't think they have landed any body blows. >> do they have to, though? >> against michael cohen, if they're going to be successful. they really o
with this meeting in trump tower where he and michael cohen and david pecker decided that they would hatch this catch and kill scheme. trump was in the room, we've got the motivation. the through line from that point up until the middle phase, we got a real sense here of how the scheme played out. that's where the documents came into play, and we got a real sense about the motivation in even more real ways. and now we're at the final phase. i say all of that because this conversation is not...
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pecker to try to quell his anxiety about whether good actually paid for karen mcdougal, whether the jury believed that or not, but there's still a concerted effort which is why you heard from the prosecution. they were there by the way, they sidebar the judge's bench. this after a pretty lengthy sidebar already happened this morning. i think about 20 minutes long, so we don't yet know what they were talking about and why the judge did apologize for all the whispering which has happened to the bench with you're on. but at the end of the day, i mean, comey has been shown versions of text messages and beyond. they're going right back to his own words. they're being used against them as elie points that earlier and i want to go back to just the way in which they are going to use it. i mean, the words are gonna be used as weapons, whether it's his book sales, whether it's his podcast, the merchandise that he has, the comments that he's made about donald trump. but again the biggest text that's important here, the star witness are 34 falsified business records. if the prosecution is unabl
pecker to try to quell his anxiety about whether good actually paid for karen mcdougal, whether the jury believed that or not, but there's still a concerted effort which is why you heard from the prosecution. they were there by the way, they sidebar the judge's bench. this after a pretty lengthy sidebar already happened this morning. i think about 20 minutes long, so we don't yet know what they were talking about and why the judge did apologize for all the whispering which has happened to the...
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. >> brian: i did it to protect trump from david pecker. there is no logic. >> judge jeanine: he said donald trump belongs in a cage like an fing animal, he has no future unless he sinks donald trump. >> steve: 45 minutes from now. >> ainsley: he said cohen did this out of revernge. >> judge jeanine: he has history of lying and he is someone who is angry and vin dickative, he thinks he is more important than he was. >> steve: thank you. >> ainsley: fox news alert record-breaking news in surge of chinese migrants. >> brian: hello, lifeguards. that's why select paints and stains are buy one get one half off. so you can refresh your space inside and out. paint more for less this memorial day. i look back with great satisfaction on my 32 years in active duty. i understand the veteran mentality. these are people who have served. they've been in leadership positions. they're willing to put their life on the line if necessary. and they come to us and they say, i need some financial help at this point in time. they're not looking for a handout. the
. >> brian: i did it to protect trump from david pecker. there is no logic. >> judge jeanine: he said donald trump belongs in a cage like an fing animal, he has no future unless he sinks donald trump. >> steve: 45 minutes from now. >> ainsley: he said cohen did this out of revernge. >> judge jeanine: he has history of lying and he is someone who is angry and vin dickative, he thinks he is more important than he was. >> steve: thank you. >> ainsley: fox...
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nobody can make any sense out of how taping donald trump would somehow affect david pecker. in fact, the call itself seemed to indicate that trump had very little information about the deals that had been arranged by cohen. cohes ba clear to most of us that he was banking insurance against trump thatinsuranc thiss to be compromising information that he might use later,e and that would be completely consistent with michael cohen.el the only consistent elementsem in cohen's career is that he will only tell the truth if tello alternative, and he always acts for his own best interest. >> so does the defense call cohen's ex-lawyer to the stand and just blow cohen's whole testimony upws? up >> well, that would be something, wouldn't it? you would just have the president's former counsel testifying against him and theen have his former counsel's former counsel testifying against hisounsel fcounsem at s. this is it's going to getst awfully strange. no, i don't thinrange.k that thy will. look, i think there's a strong temptation to just rest. i don't think they have presented the ele
nobody can make any sense out of how taping donald trump would somehow affect david pecker. in fact, the call itself seemed to indicate that trump had very little information about the deals that had been arranged by cohen. cohes ba clear to most of us that he was banking insurance against trump thatinsuranc thiss to be compromising information that he might use later,e and that would be completely consistent with michael cohen.el the only consistent elementsem in cohen's career is that he will...
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pecker, or the recording. the jury has their testimony in mind so they can see whether or not it matches does up for a witness as you just mentioned, who has been convicted of perjury, who has lied under oath, who has a history of not telling the truth that is essential to be able to use him as a credible witness. do you think they sufficiently proven that donald trump directed these records, these business records, to be falsified, which is really at the heart of the charges that he's facing here. look, i think there's a tremendous amount of circumstantial evidence and michael cohen has testified to the 2017 conversations in the white house the fact that there was the entire karen mcdougal payment as well is strong corroborating evidence that donald trump knew what he was doing with the stormy daniels payment and want did to take care of it. the fact that they needed to double the amount of money in order to compensate for taxes, income taxes that michael cohen would pay in order to true up the hundred and $3
pecker, or the recording. the jury has their testimony in mind so they can see whether or not it matches does up for a witness as you just mentioned, who has been convicted of perjury, who has lied under oath, who has a history of not telling the truth that is essential to be able to use him as a credible witness. do you think they sufficiently proven that donald trump directed these records, these business records, to be falsified, which is really at the heart of the charges that he's facing...
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pecker so you don't have to rely on michael cohen. you can rely on to people who are close friends of his, that it was about the campaign even more so, is this not really newsworthy leak that they're going to attack michael, that there wasn't an arrangement for legal fees. you just have to look at allen weisselberg's handwritten notes that literally prove the document proofs. the jury is going to look at it and it proves that they weren't about legal fees. there was about math allen weisselberg wrote in this document that is in evidence because it was verified to be his handwriting, that the money that michael advanced for stormy daniels payment, which was a hunt 200, $130,000, another $50,000 for a bonus in another $60,000 he paid for the paper, the crowd when donald trump came down the escalator and to pump up as forbes 500, uh, numbers that amount was $210,000 on that piece of paper multiplied by two is $420,000. divide that by 12. that's the $35,000 check that is sitting president in the oval office wrote to michael cohen. nothing
pecker so you don't have to rely on michael cohen. you can rely on to people who are close friends of his, that it was about the campaign even more so, is this not really newsworthy leak that they're going to attack michael, that there wasn't an arrangement for legal fees. you just have to look at allen weisselberg's handwritten notes that literally prove the document proofs. the jury is going to look at it and it proves that they weren't about legal fees. there was about math allen weisselberg...
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pecker honest. it makes no sense. jackie: tom, can we start with that? if you know, we're talking about somebody who is an admitted liar, a convicted felon, somebody who admitted that he wants to see trump convicted. he's lied so many times, he can't even appear to kind of keep his story straight or be able to recall when he was lying or when he was telling the truth. when you have a witness like that, a star witness, by the way, the other star witness was stormy daniels who also said she hates trump, is this jury -- even though it's manhattan -- going to buy with all of this? >> that's the thing. look, new york's are -- new yorkers are not stupid,, and michael cohen's entire life has been a spied if or e weapon of lies. and -- spider weapon of lies. -- web of lies. i think they'll continue to get a sense of that a tomorrow. look, the trump defense team, to their credit, has been doing a very effective job of hammering, hammering, hammering away at michael cohen's inconsistent, contradictory stateme
pecker honest. it makes no sense. jackie: tom, can we start with that? if you know, we're talking about somebody who is an admitted liar, a convicted felon, somebody who admitted that he wants to see trump convicted. he's lied so many times, he can't even appear to kind of keep his story straight or be able to recall when he was lying or when he was telling the truth. when you have a witness like that, a star witness, by the way, the other star witness was stormy daniels who also said she hates...
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with documents, text messages, and now we know testimony from david pecker from hope hicks, from others and most important, a hot document, meaning a really harmful document to mr. trump by mr. bison. i know you're gonna bring about let's show everybody the allen weisselberg document. >> if if we can folks because i do, it is important we're bringing that up in a second, but why is that document from asl in weisselberg key because you have called it the smoking gun. >> well, we saw that at the time and i still see that the time because if the jury has any question about whether these were legal fees, which is what mr. trump? he said falsely, or whether they were reimbursements for a criminal payment that michael cohen went to jail for? that's the second issue in the case where they legal fees, as trump says, or where are they reimbursements as michael cohen serwer, there it is this is the document we're showing here. this isn weisselberg. and it's a document that basically comes up with the amount that they are going to pay michael cohen, which is reimbursement for the payment to stormy
with documents, text messages, and now we know testimony from david pecker from hope hicks, from others and most important, a hot document, meaning a really harmful document to mr. trump by mr. bison. i know you're gonna bring about let's show everybody the allen weisselberg document. >> if if we can folks because i do, it is important we're bringing that up in a second, but why is that document from asl in weisselberg key because you have called it the smoking gun. >> well, we saw...
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stories. >> and what does david pecker know? i said, a lot. and he really was the ultimate tour guide. he took us back to the meeting in august of 2015, which really is the scene setter, where he goes to meet with michael cohen and donald trump, and they asked what he can do. i'll be the eyes and ears. and then we've gone to hear in this case, in forensic detail from the likes of stormy daniels about why her story was so critical to come off the market just before the election, in light of the "access hollywood" tape, and the prosecution brought such a strong case, what will the defense bring to refute a lot of these? >> i think on the down days, and thank you for being here on the day you don't have to be in court, but it seems like all we knew about trump before, and those who covered him in '16, and again in '20, and it's that he alone in a room with stormy daniels, her sworn testimony is that his lying to her was just like my daughter ivanka. he sawed vicious smears against her, and i think it's fascinating that michael cohe
stories. >> and what does david pecker know? i said, a lot. and he really was the ultimate tour guide. he took us back to the meeting in august of 2015, which really is the scene setter, where he goes to meet with michael cohen and donald trump, and they asked what he can do. i'll be the eyes and ears. and then we've gone to hear in this case, in forensic detail from the likes of stormy daniels about why her story was so critical to come off the market just before the election, in light...
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May 16, 2024
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he said he was doing it to help trump and keep david pecker honest. it makes no sense. >> harris: all right. nate foye is outside the new york state supreme court in manhattan and quiet today. wednesdays, well, some people wear pink. other people don't go to court because it's closed. >> court is not in session today. tomorrow will be a big day as the cross examination of michael cohen is set to continue. on the witness stand yesterday he admitted he wants to see former president donald trump convicted in this trial and you mentioned that he also acknowledged he is relentlessly criticizing trump on social media. you mentioned tiktok seeing a t-shirt with trump behind bars last week and acknowledged he referenced trump in each of his 2 200 podcast episodes. he also lied to special prosecutors during the mueller investigation telling court it wasn't truthful. the information i gave to them was inaccurate. i will say it's a lie. two weeks after that cohen struck a deal with federal prosecutors pleading guilty to campaign finance violations and tax evasio
he said he was doing it to help trump and keep david pecker honest. it makes no sense. >> harris: all right. nate foye is outside the new york state supreme court in manhattan and quiet today. wednesdays, well, some people wear pink. other people don't go to court because it's closed. >> court is not in session today. tomorrow will be a big day as the cross examination of michael cohen is set to continue. on the witness stand yesterday he admitted he wants to see former president...
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May 15, 2024
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pecker we have heard a lot of sorted and salacious details from stormy daniel's. i just i guess i go back to why is it the right call politically for you to put yourself next to all of that. >> well, first off, i wanted to go back to one thing which is that you're talking about stormy daniels who signed that. they don't have surely any sexual interactions, then she signed she doesn't have it. i mean, clearly breaking her integrity on her actual overall credibility, then you got michael cohen, who has been perjury people in congress had lied about tax evasion to the irs, is now saying that he falsified actual invoices, which is fraud as well. he even said though by his own words at the southern district of new york is a corrupt and weaponized court system and here he is testifying and say, oh, i cried wolf all these times, but believe me now. believe me now. i'll tell you what else it is when you go there and you see this for yourself, it's very different than when you watch on tv where they pan away from things we're actually able to see the jurors and how they re
pecker we have heard a lot of sorted and salacious details from stormy daniel's. i just i guess i go back to why is it the right call politically for you to put yourself next to all of that. >> well, first off, i wanted to go back to one thing which is that you're talking about stormy daniels who signed that. they don't have surely any sexual interactions, then she signed she doesn't have it. i mean, clearly breaking her integrity on her actual overall credibility, then you got michael...
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pecker testified to about a media organization aligning itself with a political candidate. isn't that something we should care about? it seems like a page ripped from autocracy. that is a crime now? statute, page ripped from autocracy. >> judge jeanine: this works against prosecution because nda's and catch and kills were before donald trump ran for president. >> laura: most of politics. >> judge jeanine: without a doubt. somebody on msnbc said michael cohen is their tough guy, he's not a tough guy. i've met him, have you met him? we've all met him. he is trying to save himself, there is nothing to save here, he will not deep six donald trump. >> laura: future of the country should be on the line on that guy and stormy daniels. that tells you everything you need to know about the democratic party today, future of the country on those two. >> judge jeanine: i'm so d disappointed in the judge. >> laura: you have a -- i'm telling everyone to go back to that. judge, love seeing you. take care. couple other familiar faces in the courtroom today have one thing in common, i'll exp
pecker testified to about a media organization aligning itself with a political candidate. isn't that something we should care about? it seems like a page ripped from autocracy. that is a crime now? statute, page ripped from autocracy. >> judge jeanine: this works against prosecution because nda's and catch and kills were before donald trump ran for president. >> laura: most of politics. >> judge jeanine: without a doubt. somebody on msnbc said michael cohen is their tough...
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david pecker also met with them and yes, he signed all these checks. did all that stuff? but the one thing he didn't know about was about the ossification of these documents. i don't think it really makes rational sense. i think if you're a defense lawyer, your case, you're counter-narrative has to make rational sense. i think here it's not going to be enough to have these little next of credibility. it's not going to be enough to say you really have a vendetta against the sky because does, for everything they've shown michael cohen and stormy daniels say about donald trump. they have another tweet, like you said, katelyn, they have another more vitriol that's coming the other way. so really what we're looking at a lot of folks from the defense table to the cooperators who were all kind of dirty. and i think but those documents were i the prosecution at tips have over to having a pretty persuasive case current. >> i mean, i think oh, sorry. no good. i think the other thing that prosecution does is we have heard a lot the past couple of days about trump and micro-managing.
david pecker also met with them and yes, he signed all these checks. did all that stuff? but the one thing he didn't know about was about the ossification of these documents. i don't think it really makes rational sense. i think if you're a defense lawyer, your case, you're counter-narrative has to make rational sense. i think here it's not going to be enough to have these little next of credibility. it's not going to be enough to say you really have a vendetta against the sky because does, for...
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pecker and hope hicks, like jeffrey was saying, have already been and established. so michael cohen i think is really crossing the t's, but he was not a witness that you thought before he got on that this case was was bare-bones and he had to build the entire thing up answered it really close. >> i think karatay point about how they ended with the direct examination with putting in the checks and the documents. it's important britain to remember for all the drama. this is a case about false business records. they put the records in front of the jury at the end of their case, and i think that was very much intentional and if there's a conviction, they will have made the right decision. >> kara scannell, thanks for being with us. everyone else is going to stick around the full transcript of today's testimony just been released, including more for of cohen's colorful descriptions of the foreign president. so for media and on his podcast and just why the defense, one of those words in the record, plus what the jury may make out of these attacks on lipophilic in his char
pecker and hope hicks, like jeffrey was saying, have already been and established. so michael cohen i think is really crossing the t's, but he was not a witness that you thought before he got on that this case was was bare-bones and he had to build the entire thing up answered it really close. >> i think karatay point about how they ended with the direct examination with putting in the checks and the documents. it's important britain to remember for all the drama. this is a case about...