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Apr 25, 2024
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justice alito? justice alito: well, i would thinth the concept of good-faith medical judgment must kento account some objective standards, but it would leave a certain amount of leeway for an individual doctor. that was h interpreted what the -- what the state supreme urt said. now you have been presented here today with very quick summaries of cases and asked to provide a snap judgment about what would be appropriate in those particular cesand, honestly, i thiny've hardly been given an opportunity to answer some of thhytheticals. but would you agree with me that if a medical doctor, whos expert in this fieldwe asked bang, bang, bang, what would you do in these particular circumstances which i am now gointonumerate, the doctor would say: wait, i don't --hi is not how i practice medicine. i need to know a lot more abt the individual case. would you agree with that? mr. turner: absolutely. and acogasyou know, in the case of prom, for example, acog 't just knee-jerk stay an abortion is the standard of
justice alito? justice alito: well, i would thinth the concept of good-faith medical judgment must kento account some objective standards, but it would leave a certain amount of leeway for an individual doctor. that was h interpreted what the -- what the state supreme urt said. now you have been presented here today with very quick summaries of cases and asked to provide a snap judgment about what would be appropriate in those particular cesand, honestly, i thiny've hardly been given an...
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Apr 25, 2024
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justice alito? justice alito: well, i would think that the conptf good-faith medical judgment must take into accot me objective standards, but it would leave a certain ou of leeway for an individual doctor. that was how i interpret wt the -- what the state supreme court said now you have been presented here dawith very quick summaries of cases and asked to provide a sn jgment about what would be appropriate in those particular cases, and, hontl i think you've hdlbeen given an opportunity to answer some of the hypothetical but would you agree with me that if a medical doctor, who is an expert in this field, were asked bang, bang, bang, what would you do in these particular circumstances which i am now going to enumeratethdoctor would say: wait, i don't -- this is not how i practice medicine. i need to know a lot more about the individual case. would you agree with that? mr. turner: absolutely. and acog has, you knowhe case of prom, for example, acog doesn't ju ke-jerk stay an abortion is the standard
justice alito? justice alito: well, i would think that the conptf good-faith medical judgment must take into accot me objective standards, but it would leave a certain ou of leeway for an individual doctor. that was how i interpret wt the -- what the state supreme court said now you have been presented here dawith very quick summaries of cases and asked to provide a sn jgment about what would be appropriate in those particular cases, and, hontl i think you've hdlbeen given an opportunity to...
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Apr 19, 2024
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justice alito? justice alito: on the question of the meaning of coercion, i can think on the spectrum -- one end of the spectrum, a government official says, look, suppress this speech, and if you don't do it, i have legal weapons i can use against you and i'm going to punish you for using those. very clear coercion. at the other end, the government official who has no authority to do anything for any practical purposes to that entity that the government official is speaking to says you should do this, it would be a good thing to do, you would be a good citizen if you did it. in between, there are a lot of different gradations, particularly when the official making this request has that power, and you have to assume the person or the entity to whom or to which the request is being made does matter. just as i am sure that these insurance companies were well aware of the power of ms. vullo. how do you define when it goes too far along that line? mr. cole: so, i do think that the power of the official
justice alito? justice alito: on the question of the meaning of coercion, i can think on the spectrum -- one end of the spectrum, a government official says, look, suppress this speech, and if you don't do it, i have legal weapons i can use against you and i'm going to punish you for using those. very clear coercion. at the other end, the government official who has no authority to do anything for any practical purposes to that entity that the government official is speaking to says you should...
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Apr 26, 2024
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maybe if you are cynical and think okay, maybe samuel alito and thomas are going to be outliers. but, the fact that it looks like there's at least four, it's going to be, to me, it looks like 5-4, one way or the other on a case that i agree with neil is so off the charts tells you how inured we are to trump overtaking what this country is supposed to stand for. >> what i thought i was counting was a majority, clear majority saying, no, there is absolutely no such thing as absolute immunity, absolutely no such thing. i don't know what neil gorsuch was getting at at certain spots there, where he was saying things like, well, you know, if you, samuel alito said if you do that, order seal team six, you don't have to worry about that because seal team six won't obey the order to assassinate hillary clinton. and then neil gorsuch was saying, made a very clear point to say, to trumps lawyer, so there's absolutely no doubt that subordinates of the president can be prosecuted for exactly the thing you are saying the president cannot be prosecuted for and trumps lawyer said that's right, i
maybe if you are cynical and think okay, maybe samuel alito and thomas are going to be outliers. but, the fact that it looks like there's at least four, it's going to be, to me, it looks like 5-4, one way or the other on a case that i agree with neil is so off the charts tells you how inured we are to trump overtaking what this country is supposed to stand for. >> what i thought i was counting was a majority, clear majority saying, no, there is absolutely no such thing as absolute...
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Apr 30, 2024
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justice alito? justice alito: could you explain how your rule would be carried out by police officers on a day-to-day basis? let's say that there are 500 beds in a particular town and let's y it's 3:00 in the afternoon, 4:00 in the afternoon on a winter day. wh is an individual police officer supposed to do if invidual police officer would go around and count the number of people who are getting ready to sleep outside? i guess if tt's 4:00, you wouldn't get that. let's say it's 6:00. count the mb of people who are getting ready to sleep outse r the night and then ask each one of them whether you've tried to find a bed at -- at a shelter? whether that person would be willing to go to a shelter if a bed is available without any conditions or whether the bed would have to be available on the conditions that the individual wants, like i won't go to a shelter where they won't take my dog or something like that? can you just explain h i would rkn a daily basis. mr. kneedler: well, first of all, with respe
justice alito? justice alito: could you explain how your rule would be carried out by police officers on a day-to-day basis? let's say that there are 500 beds in a particular town and let's y it's 3:00 in the afternoon, 4:00 in the afternoon on a winter day. wh is an individual police officer supposed to do if invidual police officer would go around and count the number of people who are getting ready to sleep outside? i guess if tt's 4:00, you wouldn't get that. let's say it's 6:00. count the...
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Apr 25, 2024
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she seemed to have some stepback from those asserted by justice alito. the big wild card is where the chief justice is. it would be unlikely he would want to be his legacy to giving donald trump a path to forgiveness for a coup, he was the most difficult justice to read. >> they had a discussion about the court ruling. it has to have some better limiting principle. i for one couldn't quite tell where that takes him and what that meant. joyce and chay on the big historic supreme court day, thanks to both of you. we have more special guests coming up. we heard a lot of talk about assassination. the former cia chief is with me to separate fact from fiction. later, douglas brinkley on an historic night. stay with us. th e*trade from morgan stanley, we're ready for whatever gets served up. dude, you gotta work on your trash talk. i'd rather work on saving for retirement. or college, since you like to get schooled. that's a pretty good burn, right? this is david's look of joy. and this is his john deere z530m mower. that delivers precision, speed, comfort, ♪
she seemed to have some stepback from those asserted by justice alito. the big wild card is where the chief justice is. it would be unlikely he would want to be his legacy to giving donald trump a path to forgiveness for a coup, he was the most difficult justice to read. >> they had a discussion about the court ruling. it has to have some better limiting principle. i for one couldn't quite tell where that takes him and what that meant. joyce and chay on the big historic supreme court day,...
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Apr 1, 2024
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justice alito: go ahead. justice sotomayor: could you ccinctly state for me what are the common features in ts an to all 23 states? mr. stewart: i think -- justice sotomayo bause, as i looked at the plan, certain states werexempted out because they were already meeting their emission control goals. certaistes the epa determined would be out of it at a ceaipoint in time but not initially. mr. stewart: i'd -- 'd say -- justice sotomayor: so it was very individualized in many ways. so tell me what wasn't. mr. stewart: i think -- most of it -there were initial determinations about which states should iluded, but with respect to the states that were included, the -- the requirementser-- were almost -- were mostly uniform; that is, in 2024 and 2025, the plan would only impose new requirements on power plants, electric-generating units, and for the most part, during those years, those requirements would simply be that theow plants operate their existing controls to the maximum extent. chf justice roberts: thank you,
justice alito: go ahead. justice sotomayor: could you ccinctly state for me what are the common features in ts an to all 23 states? mr. stewart: i think -- justice sotomayo bause, as i looked at the plan, certain states werexempted out because they were already meeting their emission control goals. certaistes the epa determined would be out of it at a ceaipoint in time but not initially. mr. stewart: i'd -- 'd say -- justice sotomayor: so it was very individualized in many ways. so tell me what...
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Apr 23, 2024
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that's a -- justice alito: all right. then compare that with a person who absolutely has no place to sleep in a particula jurisdiction. does that person have any alternative hethan sleeping outside? ms. evangelis: so i think we'd have tall the questions i mentioned earlier about what alternatives they might have had yesterday -- justice alito: they have -- ms. evangelis: -- and how ey ended up there. justice alito: -- they have none. they have absolutely none. there's not a single place where they can sleep. ms. evangelis: if's true, then that may be the case. and in that case, at least in oregon, they would have a defense of necessity. justicalo: so the point is that the connection between drug addiction and drug usage is more tenuous than the connectn between absolute homelessness and sleeping outside. ms. evangelis: well, i -- i think, in -- in robinson, again, the court did draw that line, but, here, the respondents are saying that the two are really the same, that camping outsi sleeping outside, and being homeless ar
that's a -- justice alito: all right. then compare that with a person who absolutely has no place to sleep in a particula jurisdiction. does that person have any alternative hethan sleeping outside? ms. evangelis: so i think we'd have tall the questions i mentioned earlier about what alternatives they might have had yesterday -- justice alito: they have -- ms. evangelis: -- and how ey ended up there. justice alito: -- they have none. they have absolutely none. there's not a single place where...
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Apr 1, 2024
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this being let's pick on justice alito day. justice alito's response to all of this has always you're bunch of sore losers. you just like the result. and as steve explaining is really much than that. i want to talk to you some more or go ahead 30, 30 more seconds. i think it's worth stressing like, yes, i am often sort of dismissed as being a progressive who's just crying in my spilled progressive milk. i don't know what progressive milk looks like, but that free. oatmilk. so there are two quick response. the first is this is not just progressives. i mean one of the most vocal critics inside court of a lot of the court's procedural machinations in the last two years has been chief justice john roberts. right. roberts has actually joined the three democratic appointees in a surprising of these procedural disputes, where he might be sympathetic on the merits to what the other justices are doing. he's not sympathetic to what they're doing procedurally. the alabama redistricting case is a good example of that. but more fundamentall
this being let's pick on justice alito day. justice alito's response to all of this has always you're bunch of sore losers. you just like the result. and as steve explaining is really much than that. i want to talk to you some more or go ahead 30, 30 more seconds. i think it's worth stressing like, yes, i am often sort of dismissed as being a progressive who's just crying in my spilled progressive milk. i don't know what progressive milk looks like, but that free. oatmilk. so there are two...
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Apr 19, 2024
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justice alito: suppose the allegation was we had a meeting with ms. vullo and she pulled out a pistol and held it to our heads and said i will blow your brains out unless you stop writing insurance for the nra. that would not be enough to allege a violation because she might have taken that same regulatory action for a perfectly legitimate reason. mr. katyal: there the government's conduct would be objectively unreasonable and it would flunk our test. we are not seeking to change the law. we are just pointing out when you're in a situation like this of conceding illegality there is an obvious alternative explanation for what ms. vullo was doing, which was enforcing the law. this is the worst case for you to say this should go past 12 v. 6, that i think any plaintiff would be able to do this. >> what was the conceited illegality? mr. katyal: in the complaint it attaches the three consent orders by the insurers. >> those are those three. mr. katyal: what they said was illegal, the insurance products with the nra. justice sotomayor: what made it illegal
justice alito: suppose the allegation was we had a meeting with ms. vullo and she pulled out a pistol and held it to our heads and said i will blow your brains out unless you stop writing insurance for the nra. that would not be enough to allege a violation because she might have taken that same regulatory action for a perfectly legitimate reason. mr. katyal: there the government's conduct would be objectively unreasonable and it would flunk our test. we are not seeking to change the law. we...
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>> i really doubt that, justice alito. it presupposes a regime we have never had except for president nixon and as alleged in the indictment here. presidents who are conscious of being engaged in wrongdoing and try to shield themselves. no person shall be the judge in their own case. those are adequate deterrences think so that this kind of dystopian regime is not going to evolve. >> let me end with just a question about what is required for the functioning of the stable democratic society, which is something that we all want? i'm sure you would agree with me that a stable democratic society requires that a candidate who loses an election, even a close one, even a hotly contested one, leave office peacefully, if that candidate is the incumbent. >> of course. >> all right. now, if an incumbent, who loses the very close hotly contested election, knows that a real possibility after leaving office is not that the president is going to be able to go off into a peaceful retirement, but that the president may be criminally prosec
>> i really doubt that, justice alito. it presupposes a regime we have never had except for president nixon and as alleged in the indictment here. presidents who are conscious of being engaged in wrongdoing and try to shield themselves. no person shall be the judge in their own case. those are adequate deterrences think so that this kind of dystopian regime is not going to evolve. >> let me end with just a question about what is required for the functioning of the stable democratic...
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Apr 2, 2024
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justice alito? justice alito: mr. martinez, would you agree that one of the reasons why chevron was originally so popular was concern that judges were allowing their policy views, consciously or unconsciously, to -- to -- to influence their interpretation of the statutes in question? martinez: yes. justice alito: why was that fear unfounded? why do you think now that the fear was unfounded? martinez: well, i think three things. first of all, i think the fear has -- it's reasonable to think the fear has diminished over time, regardless of what it was then, in large part due to the very salutary developments in the way that this court and the lower courts generally now think about statutory construction. in the old days, there was a lot of reliance on legislative history and on sort of more free-form analysis that i think made it easier for policy considerations to infect the judicial decision-making process. but this court has now made clear that, you know, really, we should be text-focused, we should be focused on fai
justice alito? justice alito: mr. martinez, would you agree that one of the reasons why chevron was originally so popular was concern that judges were allowing their policy views, consciously or unconsciously, to -- to -- to influence their interpretation of the statutes in question? martinez: yes. justice alito: why was that fear unfounded? why do you think now that the fear was unfounded? martinez: well, i think three things. first of all, i think the fear has -- it's reasonable to think the...
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Apr 11, 2024
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is this what he wanted when he chose samuel alito for the supreme court? or was george w. bush just playing the game of abortion politics? just like every republican did before him. the game was never to win. the game was to keep the game going. if you are antiabortion, you have to vote republican as long as they kept the game going. because they were the only ones who were at least pretending they wanted to stop it. equally, republican politicians didn't want abortion to stop, because then you wouldn't have to vote for them anymore to stop abortion. you wouldn't have to contribute money to their campaigns. you couldn't ask for a more powerful lesson in how much your vote matters, and how long your vote matters. your vote lives after you. long after you. millions of people who voted for george h.w. bush, and who therefore voted for clarence thomas to be on the supreme court to overturn roe versus wade, are now dead. millions of those voters have been dead for decades. their vote continues to live after them in the hands of clarence thomas on the united states supreme court
is this what he wanted when he chose samuel alito for the supreme court? or was george w. bush just playing the game of abortion politics? just like every republican did before him. the game was never to win. the game was to keep the game going. if you are antiabortion, you have to vote republican as long as they kept the game going. because they were the only ones who were at least pretending they wanted to stop it. equally, republican politicians didn't want abortion to stop, because then you...
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Apr 11, 2024
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bush was a vote for samuel alito. so yes. you can and should blame donald trump, but you should have to blame the people who voted for donald trump for president in 2016 and you have to blame the voters who voted for george w. bush and the voters who voted for george w. h. bush before that. because if dukasis or gore had won, donald trump could have put three right wing judges on the supreme court and they still wouldn't have a majority. for the voters who voted for joe biden four years ago and are no longer with us because they were lost to covid or cancer or other illness their votes are going to live after them another 30 years that ketanji brown jackson will serve on the united states supreme court. your vote will live after you. it will live in the supreme court. your vote will live on in the hands of federal judges. in their 40s appointed by joe biden who will serve for another 40 years. your vote will decide what century we live in. will we live in an age of legal and constitutional enlightenment or will we live in 186
bush was a vote for samuel alito. so yes. you can and should blame donald trump, but you should have to blame the people who voted for donald trump for president in 2016 and you have to blame the voters who voted for george w. bush and the voters who voted for george w. h. bush before that. because if dukasis or gore had won, donald trump could have put three right wing judges on the supreme court and they still wouldn't have a majority. for the voters who voted for joe biden four years ago and...
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Apr 12, 2024
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and so the methodology adopted by that man, samuel alito, on the right, with the support supreme court effectively ruled as if we are going to let the past dictate the present. in this really binding way. specifically, the white men who held power in the distant past. the man who made up the tradition of our history. this isn't some weird fluke. if the logic of dobbs at play where that states supreme court just revived a near-total abortion ban from 1864 from when lincoln was president. this is the code of laws adopted by the very first arizona territorial legislature 160 years ago. yes, territorial because arizona would not become a eight for more than 50 more years. name for judge and principal author william thompson howell, the menu see there on the left, the howell code foreman iced the laws governing all the territory. population, less than 2000. excusable homicide by misadventure, which could include a man working with an axe killed a bystander or a parent is moderately correcting his child and happens to occasion death. it contains multiple sections relating to duals, for examp
and so the methodology adopted by that man, samuel alito, on the right, with the support supreme court effectively ruled as if we are going to let the past dictate the present. in this really binding way. specifically, the white men who held power in the distant past. the man who made up the tradition of our history. this isn't some weird fluke. if the logic of dobbs at play where that states supreme court just revived a near-total abortion ban from 1864 from when lincoln was president. this is...
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Apr 28, 2024
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justice alito would refuse to leave office. therefore, we really have to be careful of letting, you know, overzealous, hyper partisan prosecutors beat up on them. the notion, as you heard in that quote from justice jackson, that is a scarier prospect than the stuff that we have already heard from president donald trump and we are hearing now about a next iteration of president donald trump. the notion that there is a real fear, the witch hunt, is bone- chilling and deeply surprising to those of us who are institutional us right down to the wire. >> i do not feel -- i feel a little redeemed, right? the schism between who they are and they reveal themselves to be -- and the hope that -- i guess that is it in theory. however, they are paranoid, insulated, thin-skinned, brittle partisan actors and one of them is married to a ringleader to the insurrection itself. was he there? did he have to be there? what did clarence thomas do? >> as he often does, he asked the first question. should he be there? no. what just happened to mark me
justice alito would refuse to leave office. therefore, we really have to be careful of letting, you know, overzealous, hyper partisan prosecutors beat up on them. the notion, as you heard in that quote from justice jackson, that is a scarier prospect than the stuff that we have already heard from president donald trump and we are hearing now about a next iteration of president donald trump. the notion that there is a real fear, the witch hunt, is bone- chilling and deeply surprising to those of...
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Apr 12, 2024
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that is the kind of history and tradition that samuel alito have brought back to the united states. it is the very logic of this court. it is the point of the decision in dobbs. it is the point of the arizona supreme court ruling this week. in 2024 william claude jones gets to control the body of women and girls in the state of arizona. are you tired of your hair breaking after waiting years for it to grow? new pantene with more pro-vitamins, plus biotin & collagen. repairs as well as the leading luxury bonding brand. stronger, healthier hair, without the $60 price tag. if you know, you know it's pantene. millions of children are fighting to survive due to inequality, conflict, poverty and the climate crisis. save the children® is working alongside communities to provide a better life for children. and there's a way you can help. please call or go online to give just $10 a month. only $0.33 a day. we urgently need 1000 new monthly donors in the next 30 days to help the children we support around the world. you can help provide food, medicine, care and protection, plus so much more
that is the kind of history and tradition that samuel alito have brought back to the united states. it is the very logic of this court. it is the point of the decision in dobbs. it is the point of the arizona supreme court ruling this week. in 2024 william claude jones gets to control the body of women and girls in the state of arizona. are you tired of your hair breaking after waiting years for it to grow? new pantene with more pro-vitamins, plus biotin & collagen. repairs as well as the...
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Apr 25, 2024
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justice alito says that hypothetical is complicated biez s.e.a.l. team six has to obey the law. so that was what was alarming to me, you have the highest court in the land entertaining hypotheticals and having a serious argument that really normalizes extremism. this is how extremism manifests itself in nation states, we're going to go more and more to the extreme and ordinary institutions of justice are going to accept that. >> none of us at this table believe that they believe any of these rules apply to joe biden. i'm going to hold you until we come back on the other side of the break. they're coming right back. stay right there. more on this madness. at three in the morning. any time of the day. what people don't know is that not all dirt is the same. you need dirt with the right kind of nutrients. look at this new organic soil from miracle-gro. everybody should have it. it worked great for us. this is as good as gold in any garden. if people only knew that it really is about the dirt. you're a dirt nerd. huge dirt nerd. i'm proud of it! [ryan laughs] hi, i'm chris and i los
justice alito says that hypothetical is complicated biez s.e.a.l. team six has to obey the law. so that was what was alarming to me, you have the highest court in the land entertaining hypotheticals and having a serious argument that really normalizes extremism. this is how extremism manifests itself in nation states, we're going to go more and more to the extreme and ordinary institutions of justice are going to accept that. >> none of us at this table believe that they believe any of...
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Apr 26, 2024
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the alito were included that thing where he kept saying i'm not talking about these facts. the good side of that coin is these facts are so bad, i can't talk about them. that's the good side of that. >> i think thomas is the exception. i think thomas thinks all presidents need absolute immunity. >> that's the great mystery. he did not recuse himself or maybe his definition of recusal is i will talk the lease. clarence thomas spoke only three times. he didn't ask a paragraph worth of questions. the only thing he raised that was outside what anyone else mentioned was an issue that was not even before the court which was the legitimacy of the appointment of jack smith. that's not even before the court. thomas asked about that so he remains the most mysterious on the court today. >> i think we overthink them. when you work for president, you know they're just guys and girls. these particular guys consume all of this. i think what was clear today, they will direct quote segments from of these programs. alito gives speeches in front of conservators and i'm sure conservatives in t
the alito were included that thing where he kept saying i'm not talking about these facts. the good side of that coin is these facts are so bad, i can't talk about them. that's the good side of that. >> i think thomas is the exception. i think thomas thinks all presidents need absolute immunity. >> that's the great mystery. he did not recuse himself or maybe his definition of recusal is i will talk the lease. clarence thomas spoke only three times. he didn't ask a paragraph worth of...
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Apr 25, 2024
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. >> justice alito, the point i wanted to make about this case does go to the general proposition. >> i understand that, mr. dreeben, as i said, this case will have effects that go far beyond this particular prosecution. >> laura: well, seeing its fantasy go up in flames of trump on trial in d.c. before the election and that federal court case given how things went today at the supreme court already slim likelihood that donald trump will face a criminal trial brought by special counsel jack smith before the election appeared to dwindle further thursday in the face of withering scrutiny from the supreme court's conservative majority. and the mood was no better by the way over at vioxx where they will need to start offering company wide therapy pets. disaster for the special counsel jack smith. at least five of the court's republicans seemed eager at the very least to trump delay federal criminal trial adding that the justice who seemed to hedge the most, john roberts, also seemed to think that trump enjoys at least some immunity from criminal prosecution joining us now. chris landau. c
. >> justice alito, the point i wanted to make about this case does go to the general proposition. >> i understand that, mr. dreeben, as i said, this case will have effects that go far beyond this particular prosecution. >> laura: well, seeing its fantasy go up in flames of trump on trial in d.c. before the election and that federal court case given how things went today at the supreme court already slim likelihood that donald trump will face a criminal trial brought by...
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Apr 20, 2024
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justice alito? justice sotomayor? >> wha never had a situation before where there has been a situation li ts with people attempting to stop a proceeding violently. i am not se at a lack of history proves. >> i'm not sure that is true. i would point to hatfield and courthouse problems in portld, oregon. let's also look at what the court has said in so many different cases. in dubin, in yates, and kelly. bond. all of these -- >> there was a difference there in the use of words. here, otherwise obstrts influences, impedes might have a problem with breadth and the government can address that, but it is on -- not unclear what the words mean. but the government has no way to address that. >> we can let them ans >> justice kagan, justice kavana >> if it were he language in c2, and so said whoever obstctnfluences and impedes c2itut the word otherwise, the whole provision, do you acknowledge the language would then be appliedrorly to a situation like this? >> unfortunately no. threon for that is that again, applying all the ot
justice alito? justice sotomayor? >> wha never had a situation before where there has been a situation li ts with people attempting to stop a proceeding violently. i am not se at a lack of history proves. >> i'm not sure that is true. i would point to hatfield and courthouse problems in portld, oregon. let's also look at what the court has said in so many different cases. in dubin, in yates, and kelly. bond. all of these -- >> there was a difference there in the use of words....
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and it wasn't just sam alito. it wasn't just clarence thomas. it wasn't just the extremist republicans that we've come to know and understand do this stuff all the time. this was coming from john roberts who fundamentally said that there might be some official acts that are criminal, that trump should be immune from. anyway. and so get into the legal nerd part of it. i know laura laura were talking about how you like legal nerd conversations. the legal nerd part of this is that what's the what is the court really trying to do? here because i don't think i don't think anybody reasonable things. i don't think anybody your panel is going to think that what the court ultimately wants to do is grant absolute blanket immunity to any president for any crime for the rest of their, for, for the rest of the future of this country. because, you know, that's a power democratic presidents get used to and republican justice this is don't want democratic presidents using that kind of power. so the game here for the supreme court is to do what trump has always
and it wasn't just sam alito. it wasn't just clarence thomas. it wasn't just the extremist republicans that we've come to know and understand do this stuff all the time. this was coming from john roberts who fundamentally said that there might be some official acts that are criminal, that trump should be immune from. anyway. and so get into the legal nerd part of it. i know laura laura were talking about how you like legal nerd conversations. the legal nerd part of this is that what's the what...
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we also saw that justice samuel alito. another republican appointeee to the court. a conservative one albeit not a trump appointed justice. this would lead presidents to essentially try to stay in office unlawfully. to hole on to power. he said that would put america in a dangerous cycle of undermining democracy. so there were quite a bit of concerns. i don't want to overstate the case and say a majority of the court is going to reulg rule in trump's favor. i think you heard quite a bit of skepticism of the degree of immunity that former president trump is seeking. but i think -- i think that a majority of the court is probably going to coalesce around some form of legal protection for presidents over their official act and the question is what does that do to this prosecution and what what is that going to do to prosecutions down the line? >> a majority would ko legislation around some protections for the former president. which justices do you think would be part of that group and why? >> well, the justices that i just mentioned obviously thinking that there is a
we also saw that justice samuel alito. another republican appointeee to the court. a conservative one albeit not a trump appointed justice. this would lead presidents to essentially try to stay in office unlawfully. to hole on to power. he said that would put america in a dangerous cycle of undermining democracy. so there were quite a bit of concerns. i don't want to overstate the case and say a majority of the court is going to reulg rule in trump's favor. i think you heard quite a bit of...
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justice alito's decision really signals a willingness to go there. it essentially says if there is a tossup between having to choose between a woman's life and a fetus' life, it is up to the state who gets to win ou we know the case will likelyt. geoff: reverberate beyond idaho. sarah: texas has also sued around emtala. if idaho wins you can be sure that at least six states that do not have the health exception for the mother will follow idaho's lead. we are seeing this play out on the ground in emergency rooms. you would imagine those types of cases and women being turned away would just continue to escalate. geoff: sarah varney, thank you so much. sarah: thank you. ♪ amna: in the day's other headlines. president biden signed into law a massive foreign aid package after months of delay amid republican opposition. the $95 billion measure includes assistance to ukraine, israel, and taiwan. president biden celebrated the achievement today at the white house, saying it was long overdue. pres. biden: it was a difficult path. it should have been easier
justice alito's decision really signals a willingness to go there. it essentially says if there is a tossup between having to choose between a woman's life and a fetus' life, it is up to the state who gets to win ou we know the case will likelyt. geoff: reverberate beyond idaho. sarah: texas has also sued around emtala. if idaho wins you can be sure that at least six states that do not have the health exception for the mother will follow idaho's lead. we are seeing this play out on the ground...
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i am so turned around. >> i don't think sam alito was making an argument there. i think sam alito was being being somewhat professorial there and trying to just begged the question, engage with the lawyer on this on this and have him answer the question to kind of tie up other questions, right? you saw kagan come back and ask just the opposite. does if we have if we if we allow for blanket immunity. does that not let's watch that. let's watch that we have that he ordered the military to stage a coup& you're saying that's an official act. >> i think it would tabassum yoon. >> i think it would depend on the circumstances where there was an official act, an official on the way you've described that hypothetical? well, it could well be. i just don't know. he'd have to again, it's a fact specific contexts, acidic determination that answer sounds to me as though it's led yeah, under my test, it's an official act, but that's sure sounds bad, doesn't it? >> sure does sound bad sure does. >> and i think you saw her go through that analysis. you heard you heard the some of
i am so turned around. >> i don't think sam alito was making an argument there. i think sam alito was being being somewhat professorial there and trying to just begged the question, engage with the lawyer on this on this and have him answer the question to kind of tie up other questions, right? you saw kagan come back and ask just the opposite. does if we have if we if we allow for blanket immunity. does that not let's watch that. let's watch that we have that he ordered the military to...
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one, you saw that when that alito leak went out of his draft opinion. they all got mad as hell and they said, we're to investigate this. the chief justice said, i've the marshal to investigate this. so he clearly demonstrated his belief that he had the power to order an investigation. and what i've been asking him and telling him and indeed told him at the last judicial conference meeting, which i get invited to, not his favorite invite, i'll tell you, is, okay, now that you establish the proposition that you can order investigations into matters, investigate what thomas knew and when he knew it about his wife's activities, the insurrection, pretty straightforward investigative stuff. so it opens it opens a window for him to lead an ethics regime in which there is at least investigation with traditional investigative principles, that if you lie you know, you're accountable and it's not just press releases from the judges. so that, i think is pretty important. and then, of course, he could always move to try to adopt a code of ethics and to determine a w
one, you saw that when that alito leak went out of his draft opinion. they all got mad as hell and they said, we're to investigate this. the chief justice said, i've the marshal to investigate this. so he clearly demonstrated his belief that he had the power to order an investigation. and what i've been asking him and telling him and indeed told him at the last judicial conference meeting, which i get invited to, not his favorite invite, i'll tell you, is, okay, now that you establish the...
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having said that, justice alito went through a step-by-step. all of the mechanisms that could potentially fail in the end. if it fails completely it's because we've destroyed our democracy on our own, isn't it? >> it is justice sotomayor and i also think that there are additional checks in a system. of course, the constitutional framers designed a separated good powered system in order to limit abuses. i think one of the ways in which abuses are limited is accountability under the criminal law. for criminal violations? but the ultimate check is the goodwill and faith in democracy. and crimes that are alleged in this case that are the antithesis of domain accuracy. that's your mind that an encouragement to believe words that pin somewhat put into suspicion here that no man is above the law either in his official or private it i think that is an assumption of the constitution justice kagan, mr. dreaming, i want to go through your framework and make sure i understand ended. >> so first on the small category of things that you say have absolute pro
having said that, justice alito went through a step-by-step. all of the mechanisms that could potentially fail in the end. if it fails completely it's because we've destroyed our democracy on our own, isn't it? >> it is justice sotomayor and i also think that there are additional checks in a system. of course, the constitutional framers designed a separated good powered system in order to limit abuses. i think one of the ways in which abuses are limited is accountability under the...
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justice brett kavanaugh and samuel alito saying prosecutors, judges, grand juries right at home in a trump social media feed about how there is not really a rule of law in this country and what looks like our supposed legal system is really just corrupt people out to get donald trump. the conservative justices today were absolutely and consistently unwilling to discuss trump's alleged crimes as laid out in the indictment that led to this case. to the point that it became almost a comedic gymnastic effort at avoidance between justice alito and the lawyer for special counsel jack smith. >> if the court has concerns about the robustness of it, i would suggest looking at the charges in this case. >> well i'm going to talk about this in the abstract. >> conspiracies to defraud the united states with respect to one of the most important functions, namely the certification of the next president. >> well i don't want to dispute that particular application of that, of 371 conspiracy to defraud the united states. >> it is difficult to think of a more critical function than the certification of
justice brett kavanaugh and samuel alito saying prosecutors, judges, grand juries right at home in a trump social media feed about how there is not really a rule of law in this country and what looks like our supposed legal system is really just corrupt people out to get donald trump. the conservative justices today were absolutely and consistently unwilling to discuss trump's alleged crimes as laid out in the indictment that led to this case. to the point that it became almost a comedic...
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paragraphs from all of our scripts i have heard in alito's rants. they are bound to trump in their feelings of being persecuted to a person. so, in trump's immunity claim which has myriad legal implications and layers to it, they found common cause with the feeling of persecution and that is what they spoke to today. that is where he found a receptive audience. what is amazing to me is that federal judge carter in california was like, the farther we get, the more murky it gets. but in the immediate aftermath, trump clearly committed the crimes and federal judges said more likely than not he committed felonies. he and that eastman guy and the further we get the more the people at the highest levels of this branch, everyone said the courts held. i think after today we have to get rid of that notion that the courts held and after today we have to get rid of the notion that there is some complicated legal theory. they feel him and feel persecuted like he does. >> i thought it was a very dark day for the supreme court. i don't think the conservative just
paragraphs from all of our scripts i have heard in alito's rants. they are bound to trump in their feelings of being persecuted to a person. so, in trump's immunity claim which has myriad legal implications and layers to it, they found common cause with the feeling of persecution and that is what they spoke to today. that is where he found a receptive audience. what is amazing to me is that federal judge carter in california was like, the farther we get, the more murky it gets. but in the...
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justice alito saying he's not really talking about the particular facts of the case? >> it's unbelievable. the reason why the supreme court stepped in and delayed this was because they didn't want to talk about the specifics of the case. they would have not even reviewed the appeal, because the lower court did a really good job explaining why trump's actions on january 6th and before were not official acts. he should not be getting anywhere near immunity, but the courts said we are going to the broader principles of what constitutes official acts, and whether that would be immune. to do some hypothetical thinking. the fact is the clock is ticking. they know what they are doing. there was a case against donald trump in washington, d.c. where they delayed it to people who are on the far right, justice alito and others are ignoring what's in front of them, and instead, doing really the former president's being bidding. >> that's the scary bit, tara. i can't think of a legal analyst worth their time that has said this is not an open and shut case in terms of how clear it
justice alito saying he's not really talking about the particular facts of the case? >> it's unbelievable. the reason why the supreme court stepped in and delayed this was because they didn't want to talk about the specifics of the case. they would have not even reviewed the appeal, because the lower court did a really good job explaining why trump's actions on january 6th and before were not official acts. he should not be getting anywhere near immunity, but the courts said we are going...
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. >> i'm sorry, if i understood justice alito, he suggesting not that. he is suggesting whether even if it is an official act whether you still grant immunity if that act does not plausibly viewed as within the realm of law. he can correct me if i'm wrong. >> that was the question. >> that i think would be a superior rule then what is in the categorical file that emerged in the trial. >> i'm not quite sure why he use the word plausible because that seems to negate, might is well -- might as well give absolute if you say plausible because anybody could argue plausibility. we don't even require plausible, we require reasonable and qualified immunity. >> one might argue that it is not plausibly legal to order seal team six and i don't want to slander seal team six because seriously they are honorable. they are bound by the uniform code of military justice not to obey unlawful orders. i think one could say that it's not plausible that that is legal, that the action would be legal. i'm sure you've thought of lots of hypotheticals and i'm sure you have as well
. >> i'm sorry, if i understood justice alito, he suggesting not that. he is suggesting whether even if it is an official act whether you still grant immunity if that act does not plausibly viewed as within the realm of law. he can correct me if i'm wrong. >> that was the question. >> that i think would be a superior rule then what is in the categorical file that emerged in the trial. >> i'm not quite sure why he use the word plausible because that seems to negate, might...
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do we have to sound of justice alito and in -- making these just what i felt were very wild claims. we don't have it. i am going read it to you he says, the hospital must save lives a threat to the unborn child. it seems the meaning is the hospital must try to eliminate immediate threat to the child but performing an abortion is and at this time cal to the duty and solicitor general when i see her i am buying her a drink she says if congress had wanted to displays protens for pregnant women in danger of losing their lives or their health, it could have eee defined the status of the fetus with an emergency medical condition but that's not how they structured this and put the expand protection for the pregnant woman. justice alito is he is pudging the life and conception act from the bench. >> let's be clear for justice alito who claims textualism is the direction to go, there's no text in the united states constitution that recognizes embryos or fetuses and in fact the opposite is true. the first sentence of the 14th amend minute says citizens are people that are born. specifically.
do we have to sound of justice alito and in -- making these just what i felt were very wild claims. we don't have it. i am going read it to you he says, the hospital must save lives a threat to the unborn child. it seems the meaning is the hospital must try to eliminate immediate threat to the child but performing an abortion is and at this time cal to the duty and solicitor general when i see her i am buying her a drink she says if congress had wanted to displays protens for pregnant women in...
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i want you to hear to samuel alito and his indignation, talking about your state. here he is. >> so we have this phrase, emergency medical condition, and that provision. and then under --, the term emergency medical condition is defined to include a condition that placed the health of the woman's unborn child in serious jeopardy. so, in that situation, the hospital must stabilize the threat to the unborn child. and it seems that the plan -- plain meaning is that the hospital must try to eliminate any immediate threat to the child. performing an abortion is antithetical to that duty. -- >> you go so far as to say that the statute is clear in your favor. i don't know how you can say that in light of the provisions i have just read to you. >> i know how i feel about listening to him or 10 he knows more than a doctor about treating a patient. how do you feel listening to him talk like that, as if he knows better how to treat a fetal emergency than you do? >> it is disheartening. certainly, as a maternity fetal medicine physician, it is my job and goal to have the best
i want you to hear to samuel alito and his indignation, talking about your state. here he is. >> so we have this phrase, emergency medical condition, and that provision. and then under --, the term emergency medical condition is defined to include a condition that placed the health of the woman's unborn child in serious jeopardy. so, in that situation, the hospital must stabilize the threat to the unborn child. and it seems that the plan -- plain meaning is that the hospital must try to...
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child under federal law and i want to play alito here talking about how the hospital will stabilize the threat to the unborn child, take a listen >> in a hospital must stabilize the threat to the unborn child. and it seems that the plain meaning is at the hospital must try to eliminate any immediate threat to the child, performing an abortion is antithetical to that duty. >> first of all, there is no child here, there is a fetus and that should be clear. but what you hear as a medical practitioner when you hear the justice saying that? >> so he is put in a situation that doesn't exist. there is no saving the fetus without saving the mother and what he is creating is this idea that there is a conflict between the life of the mother and whatever emergency this fetus is having, the only way to save that fetus, to deliver that baby eventually, to have a full healthy pregnancy, is to say that mother point there is no conflict and he is making it up. >> and to the extent that there is, to the extent that there is a conflict or they said that there is a situation in which you have to end t
child under federal law and i want to play alito here talking about how the hospital will stabilize the threat to the unborn child, take a listen >> in a hospital must stabilize the threat to the unborn child. and it seems that the plain meaning is at the hospital must try to eliminate any immediate threat to the child, performing an abortion is antithetical to that duty. >> first of all, there is no child here, there is a fetus and that should be clear. but what you hear as a...
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if one adopted alito's test it would fall outside. the fitzgerald case might be an official act. all these kinds of hype that calls has been top impeached and convicted. >> he is gone, let's say the president who ordered the military to stage a coup. no longer president. wasn't impeached and couldn't be impeached but he ordered the military to stage a coup and you are saying that's an official act? >> i think it would depend. >> that's immune. >> it would depend on the circumstances. if it were an official act he would have to be impeached. >> what does it mean depend on the circumstances? he was the president and is the commander-in-chief, he talks to his generals all the time and he told the generals i don't feel like leaving office. i want to stage a coup. is that immune? >> if it's an official act there needs to be impeachment and conviction beforehand because the framers viewed that kind. >> it's an official act? >> if it's an official act. >> is that an official act? >> if you describe that hypothetical it could well be. it is a fact-specific content. >> that answer sounds
if one adopted alito's test it would fall outside. the fitzgerald case might be an official act. all these kinds of hype that calls has been top impeached and convicted. >> he is gone, let's say the president who ordered the military to stage a coup. no longer president. wasn't impeached and couldn't be impeached but he ordered the military to stage a coup and you are saying that's an official act? >> i think it would depend. >> that's immune. >> it would depend on the...
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i think when you are looking at the questions that were asked by gorsuch as well as alito, it's very clear there is clearly a faction on the bench that wants to create a space that allows this argument to breathe further or at least them to kick it back down and allow that to be dealt with at a lower court. if you are looking in other directions, there are clearly justices like jackson who want to try and make this as narrow as possible. this was lawyering at the highest of levels. i want to remind everyone out there, the supreme court is not right because -- they are not last because they are always right. they are right because they're always last. what i mean by that is, whatever results from this is something that we will all have to live with. it should be no indication that this was the perfect decision. it's going to be interesting to see how it shapes up. >> a magistrate said that. you are asking us to decide things for the ages. i think it's always interesting to bring it back to that. these decisions will have eternal repercussions. >> right. i kept wanting to pan out. i wi
i think when you are looking at the questions that were asked by gorsuch as well as alito, it's very clear there is clearly a faction on the bench that wants to create a space that allows this argument to breathe further or at least them to kick it back down and allow that to be dealt with at a lower court. if you are looking in other directions, there are clearly justices like jackson who want to try and make this as narrow as possible. this was lawyering at the highest of levels. i want to...
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i've not been a huge fan of justice alito and justice thomas. but i thought even they can't stomach this. it turns out, i was wrong. >> can i say, you are always going to be wrong if you think they're not going to disappoint you and break your democracy-loving heart? ian, we will keep you around. on what this court and what this judge and what these two legal teams are achieving, how important is that in a democracy? >> i think it goes to the point andrew was making, that they are showing that this person who has tried to portray himself as some superhuman, superhero for his followers is human, is a citizen. i think probably one of the most devastating things about this trial, however it turns out, is that trump looks weak. the numerous times he has dozed off in the courtroom -- it's projection. his claims president biden doesn't have the stamina to do the job. it's trump who is falling asleep. it's trump who looks week. the thing that ultimately undoes strongmen is when the emperor is exposed as having no clothes. there's a little of that going
i've not been a huge fan of justice alito and justice thomas. but i thought even they can't stomach this. it turns out, i was wrong. >> can i say, you are always going to be wrong if you think they're not going to disappoint you and break your democracy-loving heart? ian, we will keep you around. on what this court and what this judge and what these two legal teams are achieving, how important is that in a democracy? >> i think it goes to the point andrew was making, that they are...